Overlooked "classic" GMSC's?

[soundjunky]

Well, since I've been moonlighting with GM sport compacts (the cars, not the site ) for a little over ten years now, I figured that I'd post up a thread about something else besides the Corvair...

(I mean, come on guys, only one thread in this subforum!?)

I am guessing by the forum setup that anything prior to the last generation of J-bodies would be (by this site) considered a "classic".

Although the term "sport Compact" isn't really a part of my regular vocabulary, I'm going to start off by letting you all know that in my mind's eye, the line is drawn right at, or around the 150hp/300lbs, and weather or not the car is purely utilitarian in nature, or if it offers some sort of sportiness;
So if it weighs more, or has less hp, I more often than not don't consider it in the running (one of the main exceptions I make are sporty early 1980's V6 cars).

Although some cars were never offered with it, I believe to be an sort of a true sports car, you need to have a manual transmission.

With that being said, some cars that I think are beginning to be forgotten are the following (each have their own sites elsewhere, but I've seen on average membership starting to slide over the last couple years);

Pontiac

1. 1986-1991 Pontiac Grand Am SE; 3.0L V6, 2.0-T, 2.3L Quad4, 2.3L Quad4-HO
2. 1990-1991 Pontiac Grand Am LE w/SPP option; 2.3L Quad4-HO
3. 1992-1998 Pontiac Grand Am GT; 2.3L Quad4-HO, 2.3L Quad4, 2.4L Twin Cam, 3.0L V6, 3.1L V6

Olsmobile

1. 1985-1987 Oldsmobile Calais GT; 3.0L V6
2. 1988-1991 Oldsmobile Calais International Series (I-Series); 3.0L V6, 2.3L Quad4, 2.3L Quad4-HO
3. 1990-1991 Oldsmobile Calais 442 (aka: Quad442); 2.3L Quad4-HO
4. 1992-1998 Oldsmobile Achieva SC; 2.3L Quad4-HO, 2.3L Quad4, 2.4L Twin Cam, 3.0L V6, 3.1L V6
5. 1992-1993 Oldsmobile Achieva SCX; 2.3L Quad4-HO "W41"

Chevrolet

1. 1988-1989 Chevrolet Beretta GTU; 2.8L V6
2. 1990-1993 Chevrolet Beretta GTZ; 2.3L Quad4-HO, 3.1L V6
3. 1994-1996 Chevrolet Beretta Z26; 2.3L Quad4-HO, 3.1L V6

Note I said 'overlooked' - there are several more examples, but these are the ones which I feel need worth mentioning before they are all forgotten about & crushed.

I'm a big fan of the late Quad4;
At one point in time GM backed them by offering (through Oldsmobile) upgrade parts through their 'Rocketparts' program;
After the engine was essentially stroked & detuned to a 2.4L "Twin Cam", GM Performance Parts created & offered a supercharger kit for the model year 2000 and up cars.

This is my "classic" GMSC;

1991 Pontiac Grand Am LE/SPP
(factory built with the 180hp Quad4-HO)



I have tried to have fun with it while retaining a 100% factory appearance - the only giveaway that I did anything to the engine is the addition of the HTF 1991-1993 (Oldsmobile specific) "W41" Integrated Direct Ignition cover;
For 1991-1992 all factory built W41 engines were 190hp.



I've added SE wheels, and changed out the factory seats for another set of firmer (period) Pontiac seats.

So what else does anyone else out there have?

Any (Calais) 442 owners on here?

Any Turbo Sunbirds here?

(yeah for thread #2!)

[soundjunky]

Oh, and incase anyone cares, this is how my car held up against a bolt on Cobalt SS(2.4L) - which embodies about the closest car for comparison made by GM in several years;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIqRnfh-3k8

IIRC the cobalt had CAI & exhaust.

If you read the info I posted below hte video, I've shown corrected e/t's incase any nay-sayers think that both of these cars are unimpressive (hint: elevation ++)

[deftonesfan867]

Those Quad 4's made impressive power for their time.

[The_cobalt_kid]

very nice, i forgot completely about Beretta's i was looking at one of those for my first car.... altho it was busted up pretty bad lol.

[rallycobalt06]

my best friend about 5 years back was really into the Cavaliers with that Quad 4..... he was seriously in love with them, haha!

[dandaman15]

Oh, and incase anyone cares, this is how my car held up against a bolt on Cobalt SS(2.4L) - which embodies about the closest car for comparison made by GM in several years;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIqRnfh-3k8

IIRC the cobalt had CAI & exhaust.

If you read the info I posted below hte video, I've shown corrected e/t's incase any nay-sayers think that both of these cars are unimpressive (hint: elevation ++)

Although your car is fairly quick you have to admit that the guy driving the white cobalt cannot drive. I mean a 16.8 in a 2.4 is terrible. Most 2.4's can run mid 15's stock with capable driver from everything ive seen. Hell full bolt on 2.2's have run 14.9 before. Your car is nice considering its over 20 years older and made that power back then, I will give it props for that. It also sounds sick.

[soundjunky]

Although your car is fairly quick you have to admit that the guy driving the white cobalt cannot drive. I mean a 16.8 in a 2.4 is terrible. Most 2.4's can run mid 15's stock with capable driver from everything ive seen. Hell full bolt on 2.2's have run 14.9 before. Your car is nice considering its over 20 years older and made that power back then, I will give it props for that. It also sounds sick.

not a single guy here has EVER run mid fifteens in an SS/2.4 - most are mid to low 16's;
I know one guy with only a CAI who happened to be at the track when the conditions were just right that the DA was right around the actual elevation of 3k ft instead of the average 5k ft - and he pulled a 15.7 ~ but I've personally never seen one break out of the 16's

... or did you miss my note, and neglect to read the info below the video on youtube?

Track elevation: 3380ft
DA elevation: 5237ft

One of my friends has a '06 SS/2.4 with a shorty header and a CAI, and iirc his personal best was a 16.2;
60ft time is part driver, part track - our track is admittedly kinda terrible on prep. (it was nearly shut down a couple years ago, and is probably going to be shut down after next summer)
My best to date in that car is a 15.2 ~ with DA correction 14.4 (4490ft DA that day).

At my track as the car sits, bolt on SS/2.4L Cobalt's can't touch it - it's running more around what stock SS/SC's are running.

I would really like to take this to a lower elevation track so that in the future people on the internet don't think that car's just a noisy mediocre car...

[Shadowbane42]

Although your car is fairly quick you have to admit that the guy driving the white cobalt cannot drive. I mean a 16.8 in a 2.4 is terrible. Most 2.4's can run mid 15's stock with capable driver from everything ive seen. Hell full bolt on 2.2's have run 14.9 before. Your car is nice considering its over 20 years older and made that power back then, I will give it props for that. It also sounds sick.

"Track elevation: 3380ft"

[soundjunky]

^^ thank you

[Steddy]

my best friend about 5 years back was really into the Cavaliers with that Quad 4..... he was seriously in love with them, haha!

Quad 4s are some SERIOUS lulzy engines.

[Steddy]

"Track elevation: 3380ft"

Oh noez you mean you took D/A into consideration!

ANYTHING BUT THAT!

People need to understand simple things like physics sometimes...

[Rich]

Dont forget about the turbo grand prix in the early 90s

[Steddy]

Nothing compact about a grand prix.

[soundjunky]

Quad 4s are some SERIOUS lulzy engines.

I'm having a hard time deciphering if you're openly scoffing them...

Oh noez you mean you took D/A into consideration!

ANYTHING BUT THAT!

People need to understand simple things like physics sometimes...

again, maybe it's because I don't know you, but you're kinda coming off harsh here...

There are alot of people who plain old do not understand the concept of elevation and how it effects naturally aspirated cars;

Any for of altitude or DA correction is purely to level the playing fields across the board - and are to an extent purely theoretical (the theory being you pulled the exact same run @ sea level.)
For example when I corrected my personal best for Denisty Alittude, the conditions made it as though conditions were ideal @ 4490ft ~ that's how I came to 14.4 (LINK)
If I was to correct purely for elevation @ 3380ft the NHRA correction factors would be;
(e/t) x 0.9588 & (mph) x 1.0437
;that would make my 15.2 = 14.6

It's especially easy for someone at an elevation such as yourself to scoff at having to calculate this - but I mean you're (and I'm not trying to pick on you) @ what, 11ft above sea level (at least the Salem NJ airport is)...

Dont forget about the turbo grand prix in the early 90s

Nothing compact about a grand prix.

I agree with this exactly - there are some cool GP's, and early J-bodies, but since J-bodies already have their own following (as seen by their own sub forum here) I didn't list them, and since W-bodies are neither compact or midsized... I left them off too
I also left off any significant post 1998 Grand Am's because they had been getting bigger since 1991, and by 1999, I don't consider them anything even remotely compact.

[Steddy]

Quad fours are a ton of fun...and people writing off a time and not paying attention to DA are fkn stupid.

Welcome to the site, lol, apparently you haven't seen me around, because I am very sarcastic.

[soundjunky]

Quad fours are a ton of fun...and people writing off a time and not paying attention to DA are fkn stupid.

Welcome to the site, lol, apparently you haven't seen me around, because I am very sarcastic.

Awesome!

I was hoping you were being sarcastic!

before I posted I was trying to figure out what you drive, and found a thread you created trying to sell LNF Stage1 parts, so I'm guessing you have an SS/TC...
(that's the only thing missing from the user profile that i can see right now ~ you have to know the person, or guess what they have)

I also have an '09 Cobalt SS; Rally Yellow w/RPD,Highrise,LSD

[TTMR]

Steedy's car:
http://www.gmsportcompact.net/forums...ory-of-the-BLM

[soundjunky]

^^ thanks!

(psst @ admin - might you consider in the user info to add/allow a spot for vehicle info?)

[The01Cav]

Another overlooked car, 1975-76 Cosworth Vega

http://history.gmheritagecenter.com/..._Cosworth_Vega

[soundjunky]

^^ those are cool.

I've personally seen two.

the only cool vega (in my books) is a clean stock appearing V8 swap.

Me & my brother were going to do a Pontiac 350 swap into and Astre (Pontiac version of the Vega) - but he lost interest and sold the car before we could...

I'm still a little bummed about him selling that car... my Pontiac 350 is crying for a good home.