ZZP SC Stage 2 Cam Questions

[07MetallicSC]

Im new to cams and trying to learn.
Does the zzp cams make power or simply move the power band? And also how can u tell how much tho expect out of them? Or is it all relative to what else is done to the head?

Thinking of zzp stage 2 SC cams in my talk above . Currently on M62, but do plan to swap to TVS before the summer hits

[Omnigear]

zzp needs to show some gains, no 1 have chimed in on it

[07MetallicSC]

This. ^

[07MetallicSC]

I understand with each bit of porting the gains will be different, but if they said our head flowed this...with these valve springs, etc etc and s1 or s2 cams we gained this much then id have a basis to go off of. id rather see something like that than .nub i was getting yeah these cams really are felt at 4500 rpms and i couldnt even lift a cheek to fart until redline etc...

[qwikredline]

ex.port head /forget cams/ intall new plugs/ good tune / end thread.

[07MetallicSC]

^ whats your thoughts on 78#s, NBS, and specifically larger valves?

[07MetallicSC]

also John, any experience/thoughts with the zzp phenolic spacer?

[mrbelvedere]

ex.port head /forget cams/ intall new plugs/ good tune / end thread.

the zzp stg1 would be good for racing with curves but not the stg2

[mrbelvedere]

I understand with each bit of porting the gains will be different, but if they said our head flowed this...with these valve springs, etc etc and s1 or s2 cams we gained this much then id have a basis to go off of. id rather see something like that than .nub i was getting yeah these cams really are felt at 4500 rpms and i couldnt even lift a cheek to fart until redline etc...

well go search the redline forums there is a guy with the zzp stg1 cams no porting done to the head no meth and running a 2.8 on a m62 and put down 280 to the wheels
the power output with a ported head is going to vary due to the port design and volume of the port etc. the weather that day and how much air your shoving in the engine and the tune so there is know way to to give you the exact info you are wanting i can guess and say 20 to 40hp but that is all depening on other things already mentioned but i will say this the car has more tq and hp under normal driving conditons and the power pickup up top is great and the car sounds and idles just like a box stock car

[qwikredline]

also John, any experience/thoughts with the zzp phenolic spacer?

No experience at all, but a lot of the peeps I trust have gotten it and say it works well. PM Distillion he is the most reliable source for back to back everyday data, he monitors and lives on IAT2's every day, he has the big race Griffin, dual pass, GMR ported head, GMPP cat back etc, and GM stage 2 on an M62 .As its a DD he can be considered reliable imho. I will try it when I change the motor this winter ( doing it just because racecar) and see where it goes.

[qwikredline]

well go search the redline forums there is a guy with the zzp stg1 cams no porting done to the head no meth and running a 2.8 on a m62 and put down 280 to the wheels
the power output with a ported head is going to vary due to the port design and volume of the port etc. the weather that day and how much air your shoving in the engine and the tune so there is know way to to give you the exact info you are wanting i can guess and say 20 to 40hp but that is all depening on other things already mentioned but i will say this the car has more tq and hp under normal driving conditons and the power pickup up top is great and the car sounds and idles just like a box stock car

Mr Belvedere has a lot of experience. I have seen 260-280 on M62 engines with a good tuner no real problem on canadian pump gasoline (other than the time it takes to get the tune right on the dyno and on the street. And EBristol has a lot of experience on various configs, with e85. 300 or so with an M62. None of these motors had other than stock cams. so.... the cam moves the power up, and as you turn more revs, you make more power. But regardless of the cams, the M62 cant make big power up beyond 6500 or so. Therefore for anyone brave enough, a TVS with an 8500 rpm limit would make the most power. For some time.

[qwikredline]

^ whats your thoughts on 78#s, NBS, and specifically larger valves?

need valve springs, dont need the vibes from NBS and the .5 mm valves are about? .5mm better.

[07MetallicSC]

Vibes don't bother me as much. Have solid mounts and car vibes as is.
Was thinking of doing them since timing chain would be off

[mrbelvedere]

take my advice with nbs get rid of the solid mounts and go with stock engine and top tranny mounts ang get a set of spherical cabs and lnf mounts

on an m62 with stg1 cams and e85 you would breach 300 i would also still spray a 50/50 mix of water meth to keep the blower and iat2 temps down cooler denser aircharge means more power some people think e85 is a cooling mod well it isent its octane yes you will have a cooler cobustion temp but the blower temps will will still be realy high is 300hp possable on 93 with a set of cams and meth i think that if you dident hit it you would be so dam close it isent funny

as for over size valves me personaly i dont think the cost out weighs the return i feel a properly ex ported head will yeild more then 1mm ex valves but on a stock cammed engine the return would be a little more then 1mm valves now you add some cams to the ported head thats when you will realy start seeing some real benifits of the head
here is a link to a ported eco head flow bench numbers http://www.outlawdragbike.com/showth...ngs-Flow-Bench
stock ex cam is roughly .396 zzp ex cam is .421
now the other things to consider is the ramp speed of the cam or how fast the valves open the faster you can open the valves anf the farther and longer they are open
the faster and longer the engine will inhale and exhale the faster and sooner and longer it happens the mpre power you can make

dont get me wrong the stock cams are realy great cams but they do have their limitations and for most people that is plenty

as for valve springs supertech makes good stuff and so does zzp so far i am satisfied with the zzp springs retainers are they better then supertech stuff i think it comes down to a matter of preferance nd your wallet

[qwikredline]

I agree. I use supertechs just because they were easy to get and a reputable part, and at the time i dont think zzp were sourcing their own.....not manypeople make valve springs, they may come from the same source. Kinda like there is only a couple of places that do cams and comp cams is prolly the best for the work they do.

[07MetallicSC]

This is more of the info I was looking for. Thank you to everyone so far for the help.

I don't have e85 available in my area unfortunately.
I do have Powell's spherical cabs. Great units.
Is there any benefit of having the intake side of the head or is it minimal?

And so stage 1 zzp cams are worth it stage 2 isn't really unless im hardcore dragging the car?

My driving is spirited highway runs. New England country back roads with 1-2 trips to the dragstrip on street tires a year.
valves look to be not worth it but valvesprings are a must..

Am I following right so far?
And cams gears with the zzp stage cams yay or nay?

[mrbelvedere]

This is more of the info I was looking for. Thank you to everyone so far for the help.

I don't have e85 available in my area unfortunately.
I do have Powell's spherical cabs. Great units.
Is there any benefit of having the intake side of the head or is it minimal?

And so stage 1 zzp cams are worth it stage 2 isn't really unless im hardcore dragging the car?

My driving is spirited highway runs. New England country back roads with 1-2 trips to the dragstrip on street tires a year.
valves look to be not worth it but valvesprings are a must..

Am I following right so far?
And cams gears with the zzp stage cams yay or nay?

you dont need cam gears with the zzp cams as for the camshaft selection it is gonna boil down to how big your balls are on how hard your willing to spin it and how much power you wanna try to make as for porting the intake it already flows extremly well would more hurt no it wouldent it just depends on your wallet

me personaly stg2 cams would be what i would buy(i dont mind shifting at 7800 to 8000 rpm) stg3 why buy them they make power 9500+ and you cant utilize all of what the cams have to offer if you want a bump up the power some and not spin the balls of it go with stg1

[07MetallicSC]

Sounds better for my application to stage 1s.
I can have head disassembled, race port, and reinstalled for 900$
+ OEM gasket and arp headstuds+valve springs

[mrbelvedere]

whos doing the porting and you dont need a race port

[07MetallicSC]

SMG does all my work.